ANSWERS TO REVIEW QUESTIONS
prepared by Rabbi Eliezer Chrysler
Kollel Iyun Hadaf, Jerusalem
Previous daf Zevachim 29
ZEVACHIM 26-30 - Dedicated to the leaders and participants in the Dafyomi
shiurim at the Young Israel of New Rochelle, by Andy & Nancy Neff
(a) When Rav Papa asked Rava what we learn from "Shelishi" (in Kedoshim), he
answered that we need it for 'Makom she'Yehei Meshulash be'Dam be'Basar
u've'Eimurin', by which he meant that Chutz li'Mekomo only applies if one
has in mind to eat the Korban in a place which is fit to bring the Dam and
the Eimurin, as well as to eat the Basar ...
1. ... including - Kodshei Kodshim outside the Azarah, or Kodshim Kalim
outside the walls of Yerushalayim.
(b) It is permitted to bring the Dam and the Eimurin outside the Azarah -
during the time of Heter Bamos (i.e. before Mishkan Shiloh and between its
destruction and the building of the first Beis-Hamikdash) when many of the
Hilchos Kodshim did not apply.
2. ... but precluding either of them in the Heichal, which is not fit for
either bringing the Eimurin or eating the Basar.
(c) Rav Papa asked Rava further why we could not learn the same thing from
the "Shelishi" in the Pasuk in Tzav. Even though that Pasuk is needed to
teach us Chutz li'Zemano - nevertheless, we might have learned this D'rashah
too, from the Lashon "Shelishi".
(d) Rav Ashi put this question to Rav Masna, who answered him that from the
Pasuk in Tzav, we would have Darshened "Shelishi, Pigul' - in the form of a
'P'rat u'K'lal', to include all locations.
(a) Rebbi Eliezer in a Beraisa tried to prove that the Pasuk in Tzav must be
speaking about a Machsheves Chutz li'Zemano, and not just Nosar - because it
is not logical for a Korban to become Pasul after it is already Kasher
following the Zerikah.
(b) Rebbi Akiva asked him from ...
1. ... Zav and Zavah - who have stopped seeing Tum'ah, and have counted four
or five clean days before they have a sighting, demolishing the Chezkas
Taharah that they had following the days that there was no sighting (see
Tosfos DH 've'Keivan').
(c) Rebbi Eliezer replied - with the Pasuk "ha'Makriv" (as we explained on
the previous Amud).
2. ... Shomeres Yom Keneged Yom - who had a sighting during the eleven days
between Nidah and Nidah, and who Toveled on the following day, but who then
saw blood again after she Toveled, who is now Tamei retroactively.
(d) And he then proved that "ha'Makriv" refers to the Korban exclusively and
not to the Kohen - from the word "Oso" (as we explained there too).
(a) ben Azai Darshens "Oso" (based on the Pasuk in Ki Seitzei "Lo Se'acher
Leshalmo") - to preclude a Korban that is brought after its time has expired
from the realm of "Lo Yeratzeh".
(b) Acherim learns from "Lo Yechashev" - that the Korban is Pasul through
Machsheves she'Lo bi'Zemano, but not because the Basar becomes Nosar.
(c) We ask from where ben Azai knows that the Kohen is not Pasul as well as
the Korban, and we answer 'from Acherim' - because if the Pasuk needs a
Pasuk to preclude the third day (Nosar) it can only be speaking about the
Korban and not the Kohen, seeing as it is not the Kohen who sins by eating
Nosar but the owner (see Tosfos DH 'Nafka Lan').
(d) Alternatively - the Lashon "Lo Yeratzeh" applies to the Korban and not
to the owner.
(a) Acherim in a Beraisa initially thinks that a Bechor that one brings
after its first year ought to be Pasul, like Pesulei ha'Mukdashin - because
its allotted time has passed and the animal has entered the category of 'bal
(b) He repudiates this suggestion however, with the Pasuk "Ve'achalta Lifnei
Hashem Elokecha Ma'aser Degancha ... u'Vechoros Bekarcha ... " - which
compares Bechor to Ma'aser, in that just as the latter does not become Pasul
from one year to the next, neither does Bechor.
(c) And we know that Ma'aser does not become Pasul from one year to the
next - from the time of Biy'ur that the Torah gives every fourth year to
finally distribute all one's Ma'asros.
(d) ben Azai nevertheless needs the Pasuk "Oso" to preclude bal Te'acher
from "Lo Yeratzeh" - with regard to Korbanos, which (unlike Bechor, which is
merely a Mitzvah to give the Kohen) they come to appease Hashem (either to
atone for sins or to make peace between Yisrael and their Father in Heaven),
so we may have thought that they become Pasul even though a Bechor does not.
(a) We subsequently query ben Azai's need for the Pasuk "Oso", from the
Pasuk (in connection with 'bal Te'acher) "Ve'hayah Becha Chet" - from which
we Darshen 've'Lo be'Korbancha Chet'.
(b) ben Azai Darshens from that Pasuk - ''Be'cha Chet", 've'Lo be'Isht'cha
Chet' (meaning that a person's wife will not die for her husband's having
transgressed the sin of bal Te'acher).
(c) If not for that D'rashah, we would have thought otherwise, based on the
Pasuk "Im Ein Lecha Le'shalem, Lamah Yikach Mishkavcha mi'Tachtecha", which
Rebbi Elazar (or Rebbi Yochanan) explains to mean - that if someone refuses
to pay for what he stole on the pretext that he has no money (see also
Shitah Mekubetzes), his wife will die.
(d) Were it not for the Pasuk "Ve'hayah Becha Chet", we would have thought,
that, here too - his wife will die if he delays bringing his due Korbanos
within the allotted time (presumably because here too, he is withholding
Hashem's due's, so to speak) see also Tosfos DH 'Ela', where the comparison
is even clearer.
(a) Acheirim Darshens "Lo Yechashev", 'be'Machshavah Hu Nifsal ba'Shelishi'.
Rebbi Eliezer however, learns from "Lo Yechashev" the same as Rebbi Yanai
(who tallies with the Beraisa that we learned initially in this regard). He
learns from it - that other Machshavos (such as Chutz li'Mekomo) which
accompany the Machshavah of Pigul, negate the Pigul (absolving the Kohen
(b) Rav Mari cites Rebbi Yanai differently. According to him - "Lo
Yechashev" (P'sul Machshavah) is a La'av for which one receives Malkos.
(c) When Rav Ashi queried Rav Mari from the principle 'La'av she'Ein Bo
Ma'aseh Lokin Alav', he replied that Rebbi Yanai follows the opinion of
Rebbi Yehudah, who holds - 'La'av she'Ein Bo Ma'aseh, Lokin Alav ...
(d) ... which he extrapolates from the fact that the Torah needs to add an
Asei to the La'av of Nosar in order to exempt it from Malkos).
(a) Our Mishnah presents the basic Dinim of Chutz li'Mekomo and Chutz
li'Zemano. We have already discussed the major difference between the two.
The four Avodos by which it is possible to render a Korban, Pasul
(Machshavah) or Pigul are - Shechitah, Kabalah, Holachah and Zerikah.
(b) A Kohen can render the Korban Pasul by intending to ...
1. ... eat part of it outside its allotted time - provided he is thinking
about a part of the Korban that is normally eaten.
(c) And a Korban can become Pigul - only if its blood is ultimately
sprinkled on the Mizbe'ach (with no P'sul other than the Machsheves Pigul).
2. ... burn part of it outside its allotted time - provided he is thinking
about a part of the Korban that is normally burned.
(d) The case of ...
1. ... 'Lo Kareiv ha'Matir ke'Mitzvaso' - if he performed any one (or more)
of the above with a Machsheves Chutz li'Mekomo in addition to, or
independent of, a Machsheves Chutz li'Zemano.
2. ...'Kareiv ha'Matir ke'Mitzvaso' would be - if the Kohen Shechted the
Korban S'tam, and then performed either the Kabalah, the Holachah or the
Zerikah with a Machsheves Pigul, or vice-versa.
(a) It is obvious that 'Lo Kareiv ha'Matir ke'Mitzvasan' - will not affect
the P'sul of Chutz li'Mekomo (which remains Pasul and either way, is not
(b) 'Lo Kareiv ha'Matir ke'Mitzvaso' will apply more extensively to Pesach
and Chatas than to other Korbanos - inasmuch a of she'Lo li'Shemah (which
renders the Korban Pasul) will have the same effect as she'Lo bi'Mekomo.
(c) If, whilst performing one Avodah, the Kohen had in mind to eat ...
1. ... a k'Zayis outside its allotted Mechitzah and a k'Zayis after its
allotted time - the Korban is Pasul, though it is not subject to Kareis.
2. ... half a k'Zayis outside its allotted Mechitzah and half a k'Zayis
after its allotted time - they combine too, to render the Korban, Pasul.
(a) Nor will it make any difference, according to the Tana Kama, if he
inverts the order of the Machshavos.
(b) According to Rebbi Yehudah however - if the Machsheves Z'man preceded
the Machsheves Makom, it is Pigul and is subject to Kareis, because he does
not agree with the S'vara 'Machshavos Motzi'os Zu mi'Zu'.
(c) Our Mishnah rules that if the Kohen Shechted a Korban, having in mind to
eat a half a k'Zayis after the allotted time and to burn half a k'Zayis
after the allotted time - the Korban is Kasher, since the Machshavos of
Achilas Mizbe'ach and Achilas Adam do not combine.
(a) According to Ilfa (who establishes the Seifa too, by two Avodos), Rebbi
Yehudah only argues with the Tana Kama by two Avodos (e.g. where he Shechted
in order to eat a k'Zayis tomorrow, and then received the blood in order to
eat a k'Zayis outside the Mechitzah) - but by the one Avodah, he agrees with
(b) The reason for this is because - in the latter case, the first
Machshavah had not yet taken effect when he had the second one.
(c) According to Rebbi Yochanan, Rebbi Yehudah argues even by one Avodah as
well - because he holds 'T'fos Lashon Rishon' (in which case, the Machsheves
Z'man had already taken effect when he had the Machsheves Makom, just like
it did in the case of two Avodos).
(d) Surely, we ask, as a proof for Ilfa, it is more logical to establish the
Seifa by two Avodos like the Reisha. To which Rebbi Yochanan will answer -
that there is nothing illogical about establishing the Reisha by two Avodos,
and the Seifa, by both one and two.
(a) Rebbi Yehudah in our Mishnah opens his words with 'Zeh ha'Kelal'.
According to Rebbi Yochanan - it comes to include Avodah Achas.
(b) The Kashya on Ilfa is - what does 'Zeh ha'Kelal' come to include? ...
(c) ... for which we have no answer.