POINT BY POINT SUMMARY
Prepared by Rabbi P. Feldman
of Kollel Iyun Hadaf, Yerushalayim
Rosh Kollel: Rabbi Mordecai Kornfeld
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Previous daf Kidushin 63
KIDUSHIN 61-65 - Ari Kornfeld has generously sponsored the Dafyomi
publications for these Dafim for the benefit of Klal Yisrael.
1) ACQUISITIONS THAT COULD NOT BE MADE NOW
(a) (Abaye): R. Eliezer ben Yakov, Rebbi and R. Meir all hold
that one can stipulate to make an transaction in the
future, even if the transaction could not be done now.
2) KIDUSHIN THROUGH WAGES
1. R. Eliezer ben Yakov - as above;
(b) R. Meir - as in the (Beraisa): If David stipulates that
Rinah should be Mekudeshes to him after any of the
following obstacles to Kidushin is removed, she is not
2. Rebbi - as in the (Beraisa - Rebbi): "Do not return
a slave to his master" - the case is, Reuven bought
a slave on condition to free him.
i. Question: What is the case?
ii. Answer (Rav Nachman bar Yitzchak): He wrote a
document saying 'When I buy you, you are
acquired to yourself.'
1. After he converts or is freed;
(c) Question: Abaye should also list R. Yehudah ha'Nasi (for
he agrees that the stipulation works)!
2. After she converts or is freed;
3. After the death of her husband or her sister
4. After she does Chalitzah.
5. R. Meir says, she is Mekudeshes; R. Yochanan
ha'Sandlar says, she is not;
6. Rebbi Yehudah ha'Nasi says, letter of the law, she
is Mekudeshes; Chachamim enacted that she is not (in
the cases of after her husband or sister dies), on
account of animosity (so her husband or sister
should not feel that she hopes they will die).
(d) Answer: He did list him - R. Yehudah ha'Nasi is Rebbi.
(e) Question: Abaye should also list R. Akiva!
1. (Mishnah): A woman said to her husband 'What I
produce is forbidden to you as a sacrifice' - this
vow need not be annulled (since she is obligated to
work for him, she cannot forbid this);
(f) Answer (Rav Huna brei d'Rav Yehoshua): The case is, she
said 'My hands are sanctified to their Maker' - her hands
are around at the time of the vow.
2. R. Akiva says, he should annul it, perhaps she will
produce more than she is obligated, and the vow
takes effect on the extra (even though there was
nothing extra when she vowed).
(a) (Mishnah): 'You are Mekudeshes to me on condition that I
speak on behalf of you to the ruler', or 'on condition
that I work for you' - if he did so, she is Mekudeshes,
if not, not.
3) SATISFACTION WITH KIDUSHIN
(b) (Gemara - Reish Lakish): The case is, he gave her
Kidushin money when he made this stipulation.
(c) Question #1: Why can't she be Mekudeshes through the
value of his service?
1. (Beraisa): 'You are Mekudeshes to me as payment for
my letting you ride on the donkey (or in the wagon
or ship)' - she is Mekudeshes.
(d) Question #2 (Beraisa): A woman told a man 'Keep me
company, and I will be Mekudeshes to you' or 'jest in
front of me, or dance in front of me, act for me as in a
play' - if we estimate that this is worth a Perutah, she
is Mekudeshes; if not, not.
2. Suggestion: Perhaps the case is, he also gave her
3. Rejection: But he said, 'as payment for'!
1. Suggestion: If the case is, he also gave her
Kidushin money - there would be no need to evaluate
(e) Answer (Reish Lakish): The Tana of the Beraisos holds
that wages are not owed until the completion of a job
(therefore, it is as if he gives her money at the end);
2. This refutes Reish Lakish.
1. The Tana of our Mishnah holds that wages accrue from
the start of the job until the end (it is considered
as a debt, and a loan cannot Mekadesh).
(f) Question: What forced Reish Lakish to say that the Tana
holds that wages accrue from the start of the job until
the end, and he also gave her Kidushin money?
(g) Answer (Rava): He was bothered - why did the Mishnah say
'on condition that', and not 'as payment for'?
1. He concluded, it must be because the service is not
the Kidushin money.
(a) (Mishnah): 'On condition that (my) father will want (that
you be Mekudeshes to me)' - if he wanted, she is
Mekudeshes; if not, she is not Mekudeshes;
1. If the father died, she is Mekudeshes; if the son
dies, we counsel the father to say he does not want.
(b) (Gemara) Question: What is meant by 'On condition that
father will want'?
1. Suggestion: On condition that he will say 'yes'.
2. Rejection: But if the father died, she is
Mekudeshes, even though he didn't say anything!
(c) Answer #1: Rather, it means on condition that he will be
4) DOUBTS ABOUT WHO IS THE HUSBAND
1. Objection: But the end of the Mishnah says, if the
son dies, we counsel the father to say he does not
want - how does this help, he was already silent!
(d) Answer #2: Rather, in the latter cases of the Mishnah, he
explicitly said 'on condition that he will not protest'.
1. Objection: We do not want to say that the last cases
of the Mishnah are different than the first case of
(e) Answer #3 (Rav Yosef bar Ami): The Mishnah is all 1 case
- he said, 'on condition that father will want';
2. Answer (R. Yanai): Indeed, this is so!
i. (Reish Lakish): R. Yanai holds that when
clauses of a Mishnah contradict each other, it
is better to say that they speak in different
cases, than to say that different Tana'im
1. He means, on condition that father will not protest
within 30 days.
(a) (Mishnah): Reuven does not know to whom he was Mekadesh
his daughter; David came and said, it was to me - he is
5) ESTABLISHING A PROHIBITION
(b) If Moshe also claims that he was Mekadesh her - both men
1. If they agree, 1 can divorce her, the other can
(c) (Gemara - Rav): (In the first case) David is believed to
divorce her (and then she may marry anyone), but he is
not believed to marry her.
1. He is believed to divorce her - we are not concerned
that he is lying (i.e. he is not the one that was
Mekadesh her), for a person does not sin unless he
hopes to benefit from it;
(d) (Rav Asi): He is even believed to marry her.
2. He is not believed to marry her - perhaps his lust
1. Rav Asi admits, if a woman says 'I am Mekudeshes, I
do not remember to whom', and Shimon says 'to me',
he is not believed to marry her.
(e) Question (Mishnah): If they agree, 1 can divorce her, the
other can marry her - this refutes Rav!
(f) Answer (Rav): That case is different - since another man
contradicts him, he would be afraid to marry her if he
did not really Mekadesh her.
(g) Support (for Rav Asi - Beraisa): Reuven was Mekadesh his
daughter, but he doesn't remember to whom; David says, it
was to me - he is even believed to marry her.
1. If after he marries her, Moshe says 'she was
Mekudeshes to me', he is not believed to forbid her
2. A woman doesn't remember to whom she was Mekadesh
herself; David says, it was to me - he is not
believed to marry her, for she will agree even if it
is not true (for she fears that she will never be
able to remarry).
(a) Question: If a father says that he was Mekadesh his
daughter, do we kill someone that has relations with her?
(b) Answer #1 (Rav): No.
(c) Answer #2 (Rav Asi): Yes.
1. Rav holds that the Torah believed the father to say
that she is forbidden, but not that we should kill
(d) (Rav Asi): I admit, we do not kill based on her admission
that she was Mekadesh herself.
2. Rav Asi says that the Torah believed the father in
(e) (Rav Asi): Seemingly, I contradict myself!
1. When the father was Mekadesh her (but forgot to
whom), a man is believed to marry her - and a father
is believed totally that she is Mekudeshes, even to
(f) Answer (Rav Asi): This is not difficult -The Torah only
believed the father, not her. (In any case, when she says
she is Mekudeshes, she is forbidden to other men because
of her admission.)
2. When she was Mekadesh herself (but forgot to whom),
a man is not believed to marry her - all the more
so, we should say that she is believed totally that
she is Mekudeshes, even to kill people!
(g) (Rav Chisda): We do not kill based on what the father or
she herself says.
(h) This is consistent with Rav Chisda's law of when a parent
1. (Rav Chisda): If a man says that his son is over 9
years old, or his daughter is over 3 (so their
marital relations are considered relations) - he is
believed regarding sacrifices, but not to lash or
kill one who has forbidden relations with them.
2. Support (Beraisa): A man said, my son or daughter is
Bar or Bas Mitzvah - he is believed regarding if the
child vowed, made Cheramim or Hekdesh, or pledged
Erchin (they take effect);
i. He is not believed that the child will be
lashed or killed if he or she transgressed.